The Constitution and Homosexuality

You can see this full discussion here

_________

Thank you for your respectful response.

Okay you have written a lot here that needs to be addressed, you have raised worldview issues in the area of theology, philosophy, ethics and history. Over the next couple days, I will deal with each and every one of your points one by one, listing point by point each issue. I ask you to respond in like manner to each point, so if I raise POINT 1 I asked you to respond to point 1, to point 2 etc, etc, – this way we can deal with each issue one by one.

You say:

I agree that all laws are ethical in nature, but I disagree that all ethics and morality come from religion. Example: nowhere in the Bible does it explicitly say that it is a sin to have sexual relations with a child. The only prerequisite is that you’re supposed to married first. Yet in our society, any level headed person would tell you that is a very bad thing to do. But by The Bible’s example you might say it is ethical:

okay 3 points:

POINT 1:

So we are agreed that all laws are ethical in nature…

You realize what this means; that there is no such thing as ethical or moral neutrality on any issue. Again, if all laws are ethical there is no NEUTRALITY, neutrality is impossible because somebody’s ethics or morality gets encoded into law. Keep this in mind because I‘m going to continue to hammer it – no ethical or moral neutrality when it comes to law. (prove me wrong)

Differences in presupposed ethical value systems will manifest different law systems. For instance the basic assumptions or presuppositions of a Christian majority will manifest in certain kinds of laws (which is why there were sodomy laws in this country until very recently), if there is a Muslim majority, or a Buddhist majority, or secular humanist majority ,or even a homosexual majority, each one respectively both in individuals and majorities will manifest differing ideas on what laws should be. A good contemporary example would be how homosexuals are pushing for the enactment of certain hate crime legislation that would punish the speech of certain individuals, for example see here.

This is important, I want to keep you consistent throughout this discussion, I will continue to come back to it time and again to keep you consistent in your thinking; there is no such thing as NEUTRALITY when it comes to law.

Now given this fact, and you might not realize it, you want to shove your morality (or ethics) down the throat of others, myself included (which is what your discussion on my blog is all about). You want to call us as you put it, the “Party of Tyrannical Christians (PTC)” – I would turn it around and call the “homosexual activist crowd” the party of fascist homosexuals (PFH) who want to en-codify their morality into law, and to dictate Christians on issues of conscience. As an honest Christian I will admit that’s what I’m trying to do, I do it sincerely because I believe that is what is best for a good and just society… your problem is that your just blind to the fact that you and your (PFH) are doing the EXACT SAME THING whether you want to admit it or not!

POINT 2

If ethics and morality don’t come from religion or pseudo-religion as I have defined it, like in secular humanism, then what pray tell does it come from?

Do ethics and morality come from the “majority’s view”?

What if the 51% majority say it’s moral and ethical to eliminate inferior non-Aryan races like they did in Nazi Germany would that make it ethically right just because the majority says so?

So again where can ethics and morality come from? I have an answer, Thomas Jefferson had an answer when he wrote those famous first 2 paragraphs in the Declaration of Independence, do you? Please explain.

POINT 3

As for sexual relations with a child. Now I’m not sure if you’re using old tired arguments that the homosexual crowd likes to make or if you are actually that juvenile in your thinking (I say that respectfully as I can). Let’s do a little logic;

God says:

-no male to male sex
-no female to female sex
-no human to animal sex
-no sex outside of marriage

Do you think that those Biblical laws didn’t apply to children as well as adults?

Keep in mind when God gave His laws to His people the Jews, those laws (unless the distinction was made by God himself in His law) applied to both children and adults. Both Jewish written and oral tradition testify of this simple truth.

Now lets do a little bit of deductive reasoning, I will help you:

-no (adult) male to (child) male sex
-no (adult) female to (child) female sex
-no human (child) to animal sex
-no (adult to child) sex outside of marriage

(Young people could marry with the consent of their parents which would be very rare and probably didn’t exist for children under the age of 12 – Marriage would be the only legitimate sex, period)

Now that logic was easy wasn’t it?

Maybe I’m assuming but I would be careful not to repeat other people’s arguments just because they sound like good arguments (I’ve heard this silly child-sex argument before) think through the arguments logically yourself first so you‘re not self deceived.

So I guess that Christians, Jews, and the Bible are pretty “levelheaded” (your words) after all because the Bible teaches that child sex is not only un-ethical, it is a heinous sin (sanctioning the death penalty) against a holy and righteous God.

By the way, what do you think influenced the West (where did it get its moral presuppositions) that adult-child sex (and fornication, adultery, and homosexuality for that matter) are wrong? I can give you a hint if you’d like…

You realize in some cultures (non-christian) in the ancient world, in certain tribal communities, and in contemporary sub-cultures, practices like pederasty (adult-child sex) and polyamory were and are morally normal and are protected (and thus encouraged) by law.

more to come…

The Dangerous Rise of Sexual Politics

Martin Luther wrote:

“If I profess with the loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the Word of God except precisely that little point which the world and the devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Him. Where the battle rages there the loyalty of the soldier is proved; and to be steady on all the battle front besides, is mere flight and disgrace if he flinches at that point.”

Today the battle that rages and is being waged today, is at the very heart of the institution which is foundational to all the other institutions, to the church, the state, and the social order .

The battle in this generation is over the family itself.

I believe this very issue is the mother of all battles for the Church today. Godly Christians in this generation must understand exactly how that battle is being waged, in order to defeat it. The Christian Church today MUST must understand how we are being attacked and than lead the way in rebuilding a godly Christian family culture in each and every local Church. She must teach and disciple one family at a time.

This article by Stephen Baskerville at the Howard Center is long, but it is a must read.  Baskerville has zeroed-in on the real nature, size, and scope of the battle that this generation faces. And it is inevitable that if we lose this battle, we will inevitably loose every other battle we are fighting, and western civilization itself will be lost forever.

______________

feminism

“All politics is on one level sexual politics.” — George Gilder, 1986

Four decades into the boldest social experiment ever undertaken in the Western democracies, the full impact of what was once quaintly known as “women’s liberation” is at last becoming clear.  The political class of both the Left and Right have colluded to limit the debate to a series of innocuous controversies: job discrimination, equal pay, affirmative action.  Only abortion has any depth, and that debate has been mired in stalemate.

Meanwhile, beneath the political radar screen, the real consequences are finally emerging: a massive restructuring of the social order, demographic trends that threaten the very survival of Western civilization, and perhaps least noticed, an exponential growth in the size and power of the state — the state at its most bureaucratic and tyrannical.

Feminism has now positioned itself as the vanguard of the Left, shifting the political discourse from the economic and racial to the social and increasingly the sexual.  What was once a socialistic assault on property and enterprise has become a social and sexual attack on the family, marriage, and masculinity.  This marks a truly new kind of politics, the most personal and thus potentially the most total politics ever devised: the politics of private life and sexual relations.  Read on

The Anti-Family Anti-Parent Ajenda of the UN (The United Nations)

anti-un

These two articles point out how hostile the UN is to the traditional family:

United Nations Population Fund Leader Says Family Breakdown is a Triumph for Human Rights…

By Matthew Cullinan Hoffman

MEXICO CITY, February 3, 2009 (LifeSiteNews.com) – A leader in the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) has declared that the breakdown of traditional families, far from being a “crisis,” is actually a triumph for human rights.

Speaking at a colloquium held last month at Colegio Mexico in Mexico City, UNFPA representative Arie Hoekman denounced the idea that high rates of divorce and out-of-wedlock births represent a social crisis, claiming that they represent instead the triumph of “human rights” against “patriarchy.”

“In the eyes of conservative forces, these changes mean that the family is in crisis,” he said. “In crisis?  More than a crisis, we are in the presence of a weakening of the patriarchal structure, as a result of the disappearance of the economic base that sustains it and because of the rise of new values centered in the recognition of fundamental human rights.”  Read on

_
United Nations’ threat: No more parental rights Expert: Pact would ban spankings, homeschooling if children object…

A United Nations human rights treaty that could prohibit children from being spanked or homeschooled, ban youngsters from facing the death penalty and forbid parents from deciding their families’ religion is on America’s doorstep, a legal expert warns.

Michael Farris of Purcellville, Va., is president of ParentalRights.org, chairman of the Home School Legal Defense Association and chancellor of Patrick Henry College. He told WND that under the U.N. Convention on the Rights of the Child, or CRC, every decision a parent makes can be reviewed by the government to determine whether it is in the child’s best interest.

“It’s definitely on our doorstep,” he said. “The left wants to make the Obama-Clinton era permanent. Treaties are a way to make it as permanent as stuff gets. It is very difficult to extract yourself from a treaty once you begin it. If they can put all of their left-wing socialist policies into treaty form, we’re stuck with it even if they lose the next election.” Read on

Messianic Leaders…

Hitler holds a fascination for us because his dictatorship enjoyed such wide support of the people.  Perhaps never in history was a dictator so well liked.  He had the rare gift of motivating a nation to want to follow him.  Communist leaders such as Lenin or Mao Tse-tung arose to power through revolutions that cost millions of lives; consequently they were hated by the masses.  Hitler attracted not only the support of the middle class but also of the university students and professors.  For example, psychologist Carl Jung grew intoxicated with “the mighty phenomenon of national Socialism at which the whole world gazes in astonishment.”

german-masses

Hitler arose in Germany at a time when the nation was a democracy.  He obtained his power legitimately, if unfairly.  The nation was waiting for him, eager to accept a demagogue who appeared to have the talent needed to lead her out of the abyss.  The people yearned for a leader who would do for them what democracy could not.

Erwin W. Lutzer in Hitler’s Cross

A Liberal “Supermajority”

A filibuster proof liberal supermajority is a scary prospect as mentioned in this article in the Wall Street Journal Titled “A Liberal Supermajority: Get ready for ‘change’ we haven’t seen since 1965 or 1933”

One thing they do not mention is the threat this “supermajority” would also pose to the homeschooling movement.

Few remember that In 1994 with a Democrat in the oval office and a majority in the senate and the house, Democrats were very close (save a Republican filibuster) to taking away the vast majority of parents’ rights to legally teach their own children and thus destroy the home school movement, which was and still is thier intention (liberals want compleate totalitarian control of the cultural, ideological, and ethical education of the next generation).

Another issue they failed to address is the threat posed to religious liberty that hate crime legislation and laws that protect homosexuals at the expense of religious freedom of conscience (like the “bathroom bill” just recently passed in Colorado) which will be implemented and used (as they have been in other western nations) to persecute Bible believing Christians.

It is my feeling that if Mr Obama is elected and gets this “supermajority”, the Church of Jesus Christ in America is in for a bit of shaking and purifying as God sifts the wheat from the chaff in the Church in this generation. the “free” America that you and I grew up in with its religious freedom may never be the same again…

Pray for the Peace of the “Israel of God”… (Gal 6:15-16)

Martin Luther’s “Two Kingdom” Philosophy Not Biblical, Gives Us Godless Government, Greased The Skids For Hitler’s Rise To Power

By Jon Lofton of The American View:

“IN ADDITION TO BURNING the so called Papal Bull in which the Pope denounced him, Martin Luther’s wrong-headed, un-Biblical ‘Two Kingdom’ theology, in effect, burned God’s Law regarding politics and the civil government.” Read On

Liberation by Internet

Less than a generation ago centralized media could and was used by governments to propagandize, manipulate, and control the flow of information to its citizens and thus control the ideology of the masses.

Unforeseen by anyone of that generation (including governments), the internet has the potential to be the greatest tool for political and ideological liberty the world has ever known. I highly recommend this article at the Ludwig Von Mises Insitute by Gennady Stolyarov II on this subject to you